The Bible and Vegetarian/Vegan Living
Comments by Ivor Thomas - 25 Nov 2007

Wow! What a nice response. Thank you Frank and Mary.

You wrote: Actually, God created us to be vegans (Genesis 1:29-31).

I am not sure we can say that. Just because some things are not mentioned, I don't think it means that they are necessarily wrong for us to eat. Jesus multiplied, blessed and served fish to the multitude, didn't He? Jesus also participated in the Passover which involved eating lamb.

You wrote: Think about it: there was no death in Eden and there is no death heaven.

We are not living in either of those places or times are we? A lot changed with the fall, didn't it? God is not behaving toward the creation as He did in Eden or like He will in heaven. Since the fall, in the last covenant, He demanded the we sacrifice animals in our worship of Him. Of course it was to teach us the principles of sacrifice so that we could more readily understand Gods act of sacrifice in our redemption, is that not true?

I am reminded of the one that said: "My God would not send anyone to a fiery torment in hell". Her friend said: "That is probably true, but, "your God" is obviously not the God of Scripture and the God that you will answer to at the Judgment. Your God is one that you have created in your own image." I never forgot that story. It has caused me to be very careful to not use to much logic and not to filter Scripture through any predispositions that I might have.

You wrote: Everything to do with eating another living, feeling being occurred after the Fall.

What about Jesus serving fish for lunch?

You wrote: Jesus calls upon us to be perfect as our Father in heaven is perfect (Matthew 5:48), and to pray for Father's heavenly will to be done on earth as it is in heaven (Matthew 6:10). So, if we are to pray for deathless heaven to be here on earth, then shouldn't we do our best to eliminate as much earthly death as we can, which included what we put on our plates?

With that logic I think we end up at odds with a lot of Scripture.

You wrote: If you read the Beatitudes (Matthew 5:3f) you'll see that none of the things that bring God's blessing would allow for killing another sentient being. But it is not the whole body of truth. If you read only the beatitudes, one would see Jesus as a pacifist. Such is not the case. Jesus also took a whip and chase some businessmen out of the temple. We know Jesus as He is presented in all Scripture, not one part here or there. I think the same goes for knowing God or even any issue, don't you? And while we're discussing sentient beings, let's combine that with a loving God. We and the other animals were created to feel pain as a way to avoid harm to our bodies. Why would a loving God created farm animals to suffer in pain most of their lives? It just doesn't make sense!

God is love and is loving simply because He says that He is. He is the definition of love. He does not need to behave in what we would call a "loving" way. I don't think death or suffering is as big a thing to God as it might be to us. After all, God sent His only begotten Son to the cruelest death imaginable for a purpose. The Scriptures are very clear that God uses death and suffering to teach us things and to achieve His objectives. This must be factored into our understanding of love". I think that God was the originator of the "tough love" concept ;-)

You wrote: We strongly believe that this whole carnivorous way of living is form the devil,

This statement scares me. It made me think of parts of Romans 14.

You wrote: and because he's the father of lies, he makes is think that it's from God.

Did God not call us to sacrifice animals in the last covenant? Did Jesus not serve fish to the multitude?

Thank you for your willingness to discuss this matter. I would like get your reflections on my observation and then I will be quiet ;-). We can always "agree to disagree", right?

Ivor

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